Curse

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Illusion 14
Inspiration 13

Sever Artery
Gash
Fragility
Illusionary Weaponry-E
Mantra of Persistence
Flurry
Distortion
XX

XX- I am deciding between Sympathetic Visage, Illusion of Weakness, or Power Drain. Sympathetic + Distortion is brutal to any warrior because if they hit me (only 25% of the time) they lose all their adrenaline and can't ever build up for a nice attack. Illusion of Weakness is a more "last resort" skill because if I ever get down to 25% life my team is probably doing poorly anyway, and I will "surge" to try to kill my opponent quickly or run away. Power Drain is to counteract Distortion because it does take away energy every time I evade. I've heard that there are swords that have -1 pip of energy but +2 energy per hit, if they really exist then I think I can safely eliminate Power Drain from this build.

Thoughts on this issue or on the rest of the build are welcome, thanks.

Pharalon · Feb 14, 2005, 12:48 AM // 00:48

You've got to be careful when you're running an IW mesmer, especially one with no points in a weapon specialisation. Get hit with one enchantment removal, and you're suddenly useless. There are two solutions to the problem:

1. Arcane Echo IW. You'll always be able to keep it up, and enchantment removal is no longer a worry. It takes a chunk more energy, and requires more setup time, and means you've got to keep an eye on your skill bar to make sure you cast your echoed IW before it expires.

2. Run some buffer enchantments. My personal favourite for this is Illusion of Haste. It's a great speed buff, and it's cheap and fast enough that you can keep it up permanently, so you don't have to worry about the cripple side effect (also makes you great against Rangers who think Pin Down makes them the world's greatest kiter). This still leaves you vulnerable to a Rend, but the eneemy is more likely to save their rends for high priority targets.

For skills, 100 Blades is a must. You'll do 80 damage to anyone in melee range, for 5 energy, every 8 seconds. Better than most PBAoE eles

Illusion of weakness is a nice spell. Probably a 230 point heal when you need it, but you'll only really use it once per engagement. If you're planning on fighting in the arena, it's a must, but if you've got good monks backing you, you can probably do without it.

Distortion and flurry are both stances, so you can only have one active at a time. Personally, I'd take flurry, because you're there to deal damage.

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 02:01 AM // 02:01

Nice ideas. I am going to drop Flurry for Hundred Blades, that way I can keep Distortion (I think I will need it to be able to hang in there with Warriors). Illusion of Weakness sounds right for Arena, but I will definitely use Illusion of Haste for 8v8. I really wanted to use Sympathetic Visage, but I don't think I will even need it now. This my damage breakdown, please correct me if I am wrong:

Open with Hundred Blades (80 from 2x IW). Follow with Sever Artery (40 from IW + 30 from Fragility + Bleeding), then Gash (40 from IW + 30 from Fragility + Deep Wound). Now my opponent assuming they weren't healed is down to 260 health without considering the conditions. Follow this with 2 more IW hits (80). Then Sever Artery is done bleeding and Fragility hits again (30). Then 2 more IW hits (80). Then Gash is done and Fragility hits again (30). Now my opponent is down to 40 health, and the process starts over. Although it will take 3 more seconds for Hundred Blades to be ready again, so you won't get to use it on the same target unless they are healed.

Heh, I like this guy.

Edit*I am considering dropping Mantra of Persistence because I think 18 seconds of Fragility is long enough and replacing Persistence with Power Drain or Energy Tap. This a smart move or is Persistence too important?

Sleeky101 · Feb 14, 2005, 02:22 AM // 02:22

I would like to point out that if you stack Distortion with Sympathetic Visage you won't be getting the most out of Visage. It only triggers when they hit you, and distortion makes it so they don't hit you. They both are anti-war, but putting them together isn't the best of ideas.

Phar was right when he said Distortion and Flurry are both stances, but he forgot to mention Mantra of Persistence is also a stance. I'd definitely go with flurry for over distortion or persistence though.

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 02:32 AM // 02:32

Won't my AL be too low to stand in there and take hits from Warriors? I figure I need some evade or defensive skill to make up for my low AL. Maybe I could drop Distortion and Mantra of Persistence and then put Flurry and Sympathetic Visage back in. Then my last skill slot would most likely be Power Drain or Energy Tap. Tell me what you think.

Pharalon · Feb 14, 2005, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Glad to see someone around here is on the ball Sleeky

Yes, Persistence is a stance, and not worth it imho. Same with distortion. If you want a defensive stance, dump some points into tactics and get a stance from there, they'll serve you better than distortion will.

I'd take Illusion of Weakness, and grab a vigor rune. That'll give you enough health to survive an initial barrage, and you're not likely to be a high priority target anyway.

Sleeky101 · Feb 14, 2005, 03:13 AM // 03:13

Yeah, I wouldn't worry about your AR too much. If your opponents are focusing on you then you are probably doing your team a favor. Unless your doing casual pvp (arena), then you might want to worry about defense and self healing.

I still think it is a little strange to go in without arcane echo or swordsmanship. Even with an enchantment covering IW I just find it too risky. The only problem with upping swordsmanship is that it increases bleeding/deep wound times, making fragility less lethal.

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 04:08 AM // 04:08

Yes, that's why I would rather not put points into Swordsmanship. This is my build so far:

Illusion 14
Inspriation 13

Sever Artery
Gash
Hundred Blades
Flurry
Illusionary Weaponry-E
Fragility
Illusion of Haste
Illusion of Weakness

Errr... I think I just made a one attribute build. No Inspiration skills in there at all... Now I'm confused because there has got to be a better way to do this or there has got to be something wrong with this build that I am missing. I looked through Tactics, but those skills are mostly stances and I would rather keep Flurry.

Questions: If I use Final Thrust with IW do I get both damage bonuses? Would the Echo + IW route be a better choice than the enchantment buff route if I am going to be buffing with two enchantments? Is it possible to gain adrenaline while IW is active?

Sleeky your right, I may have to go the Swordsmanship route after all.

Ensign · Feb 14, 2005, 04:24 AM // 04:24

Unless they've changed something since the last BWE, you do not get adrenaline while using IW. Nor do any other mods on your weapon, like energy gain, trigger.

Peace,
-CxE

Pharalon · Feb 14, 2005, 04:40 AM // 04:40

That's still the case Charles. You'll get no Adrenaline while IW is in effect. +energy on strike won't give you anything. Skills like Power Attack also have no effect.

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 04:53 AM // 04:53

I didn't know that, I am better off droping the Fragility combo and... and I have to re-think this whole build. Heh, tommorow...

Scrivener · Feb 14, 2005, 06:18 AM // 06:18

I find in Arena it can be worth going for the quick kill on an IW build (especially if they don't have a Monk). They go down pretty quick, but can be nasty if you let them roam unhindered.

walder · Feb 14, 2005, 11:06 PM // 23:06

I came up with two new builds and got rid of the Fragility route completely:

12 Illusion, 10 Inspiration, 8 Sword OR 12,12,3(Sword)

Arcane Echo
Illusionary Weaponry-E
Conjure Phantasm
Hundred Blades
Distortion
Spirit of Failure
Frenzy
Energy Tap

------------------------------------------------

12 Illusion, 10 Tactics, 8 Sword OR 12,12,3(Sword)

Illusionary Weaponry-E
Disciplined Stance
Conjure Phantasm
Hundred Blades
Flurry
Watch Yourself!
Illusion of Haste
Healing Signet

1) In the first build, I am assuming that "evade" from Distortion will trigger a "miss" from Spirit of Failure. If not then the second build is much better. But if it does trigger then the energy lost from Distortion won't matter because I will be gaining it right back with SoF. Then the other skills are for helping IW and keeping it running. Frenzy is there because I can't use Flurry with Distortion.

2) In this build energy could be a problem. I threw in Healing Signet at the end because I couldn't think of anything else. I am using IoH to protect IW and Disciplined Stance and Watch Yourself for more defense. Everything else is pretty similar to the first build.

Sleeky101 · Feb 15, 2005, 03:37 AM // 03:37

Frenzy is a stance, as well as Disciplined Stance. IMO just stick with flurry as the only stance in both cases.

For a 12 Illusion/ 10 sword/ 8 inspiration I'd go with something like:

IW
Hundred Blades
Flurry
Conjure Phantasm
Energy Drain (More aggressive then tap, almost completely better than tap)
*
*
*-Can be used for enchantment protectors of IW, arcane echo, warrior hate, energy management, possibly an adren skill

Splashing tactics doesn't offer much since most of it is stances. Healing signet won't really save you either, and the cost of Watch Yourself! could add up.

Have you looked into domination? Depends if you plan on taking on warriors or casters.

Hope that helps.

*EDIT- I'm pretty sure Spirit of Failure would trigger in that case.

BlackArrow · Feb 15, 2005, 03:52 AM // 03:52

I'm planning on play a Me/W this weekend. here's my setup:

Illusion 12
Tactics 12
Fast Casting 3(could change if I found something better)

Conjure Phantasm
Phantom Pain
Illusionary Weaponry - E
Flurry
Hundred Blades
Disciplined Stance
Bonetti's Defense
Healing Signet

The idea is to cast Conjure and Phantom on the target before engaging with IW. Flurry and Hundred Blades for the damage. Disciplined Stance is mostly just defence for the 10 seconds I won't have IW (barring enchant removal). Bonetti's Defense for energy gain. Heal Sig for emergency healing.

walder · Feb 16, 2005, 03:58 AM // 03:58

I was looking through Sausaletus Rex's Mes/W build and I liked it a lot. I took a few ideas from there and mixed it with what I was already thinking of. This is the build I think I will run:

8 Fast Cast
12 Illusion
10 Tactics

IW-E
Hundred Blades
Flurry
Disciplined Stance
Illusion of Haste
Conjure Phantasm
Distracting Blow
Sympathetic Visage

I can use IW+HB+Flurry for damage. Dsiciplined Stance+Sympathetic Visage is for counter and defense. IoH+Sympathetic is for speed and enchantment buffs to protect IW. Phantasm is for some extra damage and Distracting is a nice interrupt. I really liked the interrupt idea from Rex's build.

Is Fast Casting really necessairy here?

Pharalon · Feb 16, 2005, 04:10 AM // 04:10

Not really, but there's no where else to put your points, is there

BlackArrow · Feb 16, 2005, 05:34 AM // 05:34

Just bump up Tactics to 12 and drop FC to 3 like in my build above. I'll move those if I find another attribute I want to use in this.

walder · Feb 17, 2005, 04:30 AM // 04:30

Yea, I will go 12/12/3 as I really have no need for a high Fast Cast.